Build that deck once and never have to worry about wood rot.

[: 00:00:00

[00:00:20] Jeff Schulz: Um, for example, we've got three different sizes that, yeah. Pre cut, pre-roll, one sku, you open it up, it's a, let's call it a three by three bundle. Everything you need to build that per. Now,

[: 00:00:30

[00:00:37] Eric Goranson: A hundred

[: 00:00:37

[00:00:47] Jeff Schulz: when it comes to remodeling and renovating your homes. There is a lot to know. The leave got you covered. This is around the house.

[: 00:00:59

[00:01:18] Eric Goranson: I am down here at the Fortress Building Products booth. Let's get some introductions to your guys, so the listeners you. What the voices sound like. Go ahead Jeff. Start

[: 00:01:28

[00:01:37] Jeff Schulz: I've been with the company for 12 years, so it's been an amazing ride for us and Nice. It's funny to say down here for the week, it's gonna take you a week just to go through all the different halls because this is, I would say from an excitement level, the. I mean, the most well attended IBS show that I've seen probably in a decade.

[: 00:01:52

[00:02:08] Jeff Schulz: So,

[: 00:02:09

[00:02:12] Jeff Schulz: percent. And, but I mean, even last year in Orlando, like was decent. I low expectations here is anybody here? But this year is by far the busiest I've seen in 10 years easily.

[: 00:02:21

[00:02:28] Eric Goranson: Right. Oh. You know,

[: 00:02:29

[00:02:37] Eric Goranson: Yeah, exactly. And my Uber ride was like $52 with search pricing. So for me to go just over to the Palms, I was like, Awesome guys. Yeah. Thank you.

[: 00:02:45

[00:02:48] Tim Sandlund: Yeah. Tim Salan. I'm the director of Marketing for Fortress. Been here for just about two years. Nice. So I've been in the industry with building products for 10 years, so, ah, love this show. Love the people that attend it. [00:03:00] Uh, and thanks for having us.

[: 00:03:01

[00:03:01] Eric Goranson: Let's talk about Fortress Building products is you guys have your hands in so many different things and quite frankly do it really well, but you're just not that one trick pony either, right?

[: 00:03:11

[00:03:19] Tim Sandlund: Yes, we do it with uh, same material. You can do a steel pers as well and we'll get into the benefits of that. Got, we've got decking, fasteners, railing, fencing. Am I miss clouding? CLA cladding. Yes. Or decking that goes un cloudy. And then of course lighting and accessories. Yeah.

[: 00:03:35

[00:03:45] Eric Goranson: Yeah. And,

[: 00:03:45

[00:04:01] Jeff Schulz: Well, great, here's the railing to match. Here's the decking, here's the fast moves, here's the lighting. Oh, here's a Perla, here's a perimeter fence From that perspective, and then you get into commercial applications. We have products even used in the high security world from a fencing standpoint. See around a data center.

[: 00:04:15

[00:04:21] Eric Goranson: little tiny company up the street called Intel from my office. You know, so little guys, you know, they know a little bit about computers, but Yeah.

[: 00:04:28

[00:04:47] Eric Goranson: Right. Or it got rotten. You guys have that solution and the way wood prices have been, sometimes the lesser cost solution because you don't have to have the Brinks truck to go by the lumber.

[: 00:04:58

[00:05:06] Tim Sandlund: But what, what we've seen even past them is the labor savings. Yeah. And also just the peace of mind that comes with the steel deck framing. So you're putting. Deposit, PVC decking, alternative decking, that's 25, 50 year warranties. And then you're putting a wood frame underneath that is gonna rot and you know who knows how long.

[: 00:05:23

[00:05:40] Tim Sandlund: Everything is the exact size. It's not like your lumber, and you get the benefit of the strength of steel. Everything

[: 00:05:45

[00:05:58] Eric Goranson: It's like taking a car and putting [00:06:00] a 50 year warranty on a hundred thousand mile, you know, pain job on a car that's got 200,000 miles on it that you're gonna get maybe a few more years out of. Doesn't make any sense. Right. And it's so much easier to work with, you know, lumber. You know, all right. This one's twisted.

[: 00:06:15

[00:06:16] Jeff Schulz: this dimension and even the weight, even the weight of lumber, people think, oh, steel's heavy. But when you start getting into long, those long spans and beams, things of that nature with wood, I mean, it is, uh, the steel is actually gonna be a lighter, easier product to install. Yeah.

[: 00:06:30

[00:06:32] Eric Goranson: You know what it's gonna do. You know where it's gonna move. Right. Not where wood, it's like, oh, that I gotta hump now because this was twisting right. Or something weird was going on. It's you set it and

[: 00:06:41

[00:06:49] Jeff Schulz: Sure. You know, but you look really the global market outside of the us. So you see framing systems, uh, in Australia, Africa, South Africa. You'll see Europe where, where the, the [00:07:00] resources aren't as al so you don't have the wood, all the forest if you will. It's commonplace in those other markets. So now what's great for us is really seeing this rapid adoption in North America with people recognizing the benefits of skill framing.

[: 00:07:14

[00:07:33] Jeff Schulz: Yeah. I can do this so much quicker. We've got contractors, you know, the first question we always get is, Ugh. You know, what's that cost compared to wood? Right? Right. You know, what's the first cost? And what we find in J, like we had a contractor do their own internal case study and said, Our difference between steel and wood, it's cost us 2% more to do steel because the labor savings is so immense that it is.

[: 00:07:54

[00:08:00] Eric Goranson: steel, why would you do wood then? I mean, honestly, it's great. 2% a great question. I mean, that's okay. I'm gonna go bring that up in the bar tab tonight. With that 2% of that is gonna be, let's be honest.

[: 00:08:11

[00:08:25] Tim Sandlund: So me being the marketing guy, yeah, they're looking at, you know, they may have five, 10 other contractors in their region. You have a big city that all do timber tech tracks some of. Fortress decking. Yeah. Right. And so they're all doing composite BC Well now they can differentiate themselves as saying, all right, well we do all the, the high-end stuff and now we do steel framing, and that's all we do.

[: 00:08:46

[00:09:03] Tim Sandlund: Right? Because homeowners aren't only thinking really about the deck and the railing, right? Right. They don't really think about what goes underneath. Yeah. So talk about how to sell steel framing. One thing he does is he'll go to someone's house and go underneath the deck and show the wood and he'll, he'll show all the wood and see, look, look at everything Roddy.

[: 00:09:20

[00:09:33] Tim Sandlund: Yeah, it's beautiful, but it's gonna last far more many years than your woods. So he goes and says, think of this steel your, your wood's falling apart. Your steel's not your entire frame's gonna be this. And it clicks with homeowners like, all right, I'm investing in something bigger and than just steel framing.

[: 00:09:52

[00:09:58] Eric Goranson: maintenance. Yeah, I mean, we've got a [00:10:00] lot of listeners here internationally in this show. Are the top podcast in, in New Zealand. Awesome. Ireland, South Korea. We've got a bunch of different stuff out there for few listeners, so a lot of you guys are shaking your head going, what?

[: 00:10:10

[00:10:29] Eric Goranson: They're perfect. But this framing's. Part because of the rot, whether it's the moisture or the heat or whatever it's happening. Well,

[: 00:10:37

[00:10:49] Jeff Schulz: Of course, our steel framing is designed with, with work, with any deck wood. It may be wood, it may be composite, may be pvc. It doesn't necessarily. To be ours. And we recognize that and we respect it. That's how it was developed for yeah. To be [00:11:00] a component and a segment of the business that makes it safer, quicker to install from that perspective.

[: 00:11:05

[00:11:22] Jeff Schulz: Uh, several weeks guys, but, so now we've got a brand presence with our products on six continents. Three or four of them actually is now going to be framing is this is really pushing globally as well outside of the US and, and Canada. Yeah,

[: 00:11:40

[00:11:40] Tim Sandlund: think that's great. I think also, and Jeff can speak, as we were talking about this this morning, we were talking a lot about residential homes on the, on the steel deck framing, but we're seeing huge opportunities on the commercial side.

[: 00:11:50

[00:11:56] Eric Goranson: gosh.

[: 00:11:56

[00:12:01] Eric Goranson: stickers on everything. See, that's it. I mean, I've got plenty of friends that are down in SoCal that are down there and they're like, okay, yeah, all right, I gotta come up with something that's Class A fire rated.

[: 00:12:10

[00:12:30] Eric Goranson: Right. But for the people out there, like you said, that hey, this is my angle. I always use these guys. You guys also have the decking. You've also got the the, the railing and stuff, which is another key part of this whole

[: 00:12:42

[00:12:48] Jeff Schulz: Right? Yeah. There's industry leaders that have been here for years and there's people aligned. We get that. We see our products being able to play a role in virtually any build, whether it's the entire build or a component of that build. And that's what's [00:13:00] exciting. And you know, we look at the other things that we don't.

[: 00:13:02

[00:13:21] Jeff Schulz: A frame. Cause I'm worried they're gonna say it's too expensive. I would go back and say, well, it's not A, but B, if you've done, if you've worked with a homeowner and you've got them converted from wood to a composite of piece, you've done the hard work. Right? That's the biggest upcharge in a decade is going this.

[: 00:13:37

[00:13:50] Eric Goranson: is. Yeah. Now we're in the south coast.

[: 00:13:52

[00:14:09] Eric Goranson: Everything else, right. Forget you're just set and. There is none of that extra waterproofing that you guys have to do Exactly. Just to try to make an extra life outta that whole thing.

[: 00:14:19

[00:14:27] Jeff Schulz: You know, and I know we're talking about the framing here, but it ties indoor other products. You look at our railing, for example. Yeah. So we used, uh, what we call a black sand finish. Mm-hmm. . So that same black sand finish matches the railing to the framing in one small part. Another thing from a labor standpoint is I don't.

[: 00:14:43

[00:14:54] Eric Goranson: as well. And it's huge because now you've got steel there, which is as durable it's gonna be, right.

[: 00:14:59

[00:15:16] Eric Goranson: And you're not trying to hide the ugly stuff

[: 00:15:18

[00:15:32] Jeff Schulz: And you can take that five and a half inch now up to 20 foot in length. So you want to do a two story deck, you want to add a. Guess what? We've got that solution. Now. We're in the past as we launched that product. Hey, we're coming. We're coming. Well, we're there now. And it's just another aspect that allows a builder to differentiate

[: 00:15:47

[00:15:47] Eric Goranson: I hate doing two story decks outta wood because that four by four, that's max 16 feet up there, right? That. Thing wants to get into its own shape. , I'm like, this thing's gonna look like a candy cane when I'm done. That it wasn't right. Wasn't supposed to go, [00:16:00] it wasn't a spiral. You're right. Right. It's just, and you, and you look at it and something's moving.

[: 00:16:05

[00:16:25] Eric Goranson: That lighting to me is probably one of the most important aesthetic things and safety things you can do on that deck. That's the thing when your friends come over at night and you got the barbecue going, yeah. They go, what is going on out here? Yeah.

[: 00:16:39

[00:16:43] Tim Sandlund: And that sometimes gets overlooked at times, right? Uhhuh, , but it's the, it's the piece that when you build that deck, you're gonna notice it the most. Right. From a safety perspective, when you're sitting. Night, uh, my parents actually put a fortress deck, rail and light on their house, and every time we go there at night, I'm like, I need [00:17:00] this on my house.

[: 00:17:00

[00:17:16] Eric Goranson: That's what takes it, that from that kind of entry level deck into that luxury by just adding.

[: 00:17:22

[00:17:39] Jeff Schulz: Every single job you should be trying to sell or pitching, adding lighting for that aspect. From a business perspective, why not make some extra gross margin? Why not make some extra install dollars on that? On that deck, every single deck you should be pitching, lighting for the enhancement of not only your pocket pocketbook, but the enhancement of the [00:18:00] ambiance to the consumer.

[: 00:18:00

[00:18:17] Jeff Schulz: I think there are, sometimes you'll run in, you know, contractors that sometimes like, oh, I don't know if I want to pitch this.

[: 00:18:22

[00:18:39] Jeff Schulz: I could have had lighting and steel framing. Why didn't you pick something? Cause you were afraid I would say no. Yeah, you did me

[: 00:18:44

[00:18:53] Eric Goranson: I did. Right? But the duck had a 50 year warranty. Well, yeah. That top pretty side did the rest of it, you understand? Not so much. [00:19:00] Right? Yep. . That's great. And by the way, those big posts talk about, make a statement, right? I mean, there, there's function there too, right? Yeah. You know, for big fans, but they give that, they just give that seriousness to it, you know?

[: 00:19:14

[00:19:30] Jeff Schulz: do like that it's been, it makes a statement.

[: 00:19:32

[00:19:49] Tim Sandlund: Right. Steel framing for the last couple years has really taken off. Right? Yeah. You're seeing competitors get into this alternative framing opportunity, right. They're seeing we, we own the deck, we own the rail, [00:20:00] everything above, and now of a sudden there's an opportunity underneath the deck. Yeah. In that frame.

[: 00:20:04

[00:20:22] Tim Sandlund: Right. We need to solve this problem. And our team, our innovation team, our product team, done a great job of taking that feedback, figuring out solutions, not really solutions for them, but also meet the code requirements that That's always moving. Yeah. That we expect that you're gonna get from Fortress.

[: 00:20:38

[00:20:57] Eric Goranson: Exactly. Let's step outside here and talk these [00:21:00] pergolas, those are gorgeous as well. And again, not made of wood . Yeah.

[: 00:21:05

[00:21:16] Jeff Schulz: Just like with Covid, the entire outdoor space. GLIs, you know, s have been strong in many markets throughout, well North America, but globally for years. Yeah. But we, we've seen just like all of outdoors accelerate during, um, the past three years. But you look at that, when we take Pergo, take that same material that you're making with framing it now allows you to even enhance that build.

[: 00:21:35

[00:21:55] Jeff Schulz: But it is something exciting for us. We've always been able to build and we've had contractors from day one [00:22:00] taking our framing components and making custom pergolas. Yep. What we've launched now over the past couple months, pergola kits, so a single sku, everything you need for a 12 by 12 Pergo up. Um, for example, we've got three different sizes that Yeah.

[: 00:22:12

[00:22:19] Eric Goranson: So, dude, that is amazing. And it is, there's no thought to it. You're just gonna follow the directions, put it together. Made to go that way. A hundred percent. Yeah.

[: 00:22:26

[00:22:32] Tim Sandlund: Right. And so we call that kind of the limitless design options. Yeah. And a lot of what we're showing today is a lot of new parts and pieces. Right. If you want that modern cola Right. You want a more traditional pergola. Now we've got these other pieces to help them build whatever they want. Yeah. Or you've got the homeowner or maybe that diy or that's like, well, I just want, you know, a 12 by 12 or a eight by 10.

[: 00:22:51

[00:23:03] Eric Goranson: and there's nothing much more DIY friendly for someone to put that together. Right. I mean, for sure. It's, it's no different than going to that, uh, Swedish box store and putting things together.

[: 00:23:15

[00:23:21] Tim Sandlund: I'm not allowed to touch those stuff and I, I can build a

[: 00:23:24

[00:23:26] Tim Sandlund: Put a drill in my hand and you know, something's gonna happen.

[: 00:23:31

[00:23:33] Eric Goranson: There you go. But that's what's smart about that for the, there's all these people out there. Hey, I can afford to put the burglary kit in, but I can't pay the contractor do it. There's still a solution for 'em. Right.

[: 00:23:44

[00:23:51] Jeff Schulz: So from a cost perspective, the steel, we can actually see steel perilla installed at a lower cost than certain species of wood. So it is, it's not [00:24:00] all about cost, it's about that ease of installation. It's. Ongoing maintenance that says, man, I'm looking at this Pergo, it looks great. I stained it. Oh wait, it's a year later.

[: 00:24:08

[00:24:11] Eric Goranson: And what's worse though is if you've got those beautiful vines, cuz you're trying to grow something across the top, right? If you've gotta painted or you've stained it, they've grown. Everything's good. And now you're like, how am I gonna do this with plants on it?

[: 00:24:24

[00:24:28] Jeff Schulz: hundred

[: 00:24:29

[00:24:41] Eric Goranson: Right? That's not always the case.

[: 00:24:43

[00:24:58] Tim Sandlund: Right? A mixed material look. Yeah. Whether it be on the [00:25:00] side or even on the top of the burg. And we're seeing I in Austin, Austin, Texas visiting, uh, a build and was a homeowner doing it, and he did a mixed material and it looks and looks incredible. Yeah. So it opens up a lot of opportunities there from inside

[: 00:25:13

[00:25:13] Eric Goranson: Well, sometimes you. In a tight space. Many homes out there, you know, new developments where, you know, there's eight, 10 feet between the house, right? You wanna put the Pergo up and you're like, Hey, I'm tired of Mr. Smith next door watching me. Every time I'm out there in the barbecue, I want to kind of shield it a little bit.

[: 00:25:28

[00:25:28] Jeff Schulz: Tim usually says he'd rather you watch 'em in the shower. So I get exactly

[: 00:25:34

[00:25:43] Eric Goranson: shades. Yeah, I know it's a. Not the same issue downstairs.

[: 00:25:46

[00:26:04] Eric Goranson: Cuz that's what people come here for, right? Yeah. Is they're, they're looking for that new

[: 00:26:07

[00:26:19] Tim Sandlund: Ooh. So a very modern walk. Right. That's very on trend right now. You're seeing it. You go online and look for modern rail, like you're starting to see this more custom made. Yeah. Well now we offer it in our FT 26 line. So nice analyze system. Right. So much quicker install. And, you know, you talked a little bit more about that from a sales perspective, but it's, it's, it's taken off like people are seeing this and being like, this is amazing.

[: 00:26:44

[00:26:56] Eric Goranson: It seemed forever. You'd have, you had two choices, right? You had glass or [00:27:00] cable, right?

[: 00:27:00

[00:27:12] Jeff Schulz: a brilliant. and it, it applies to not only residential, but commercial. Mm-hmm. . Uh, but we look at, one of the things that we're excited about too with this infill option, just like our standard FE 26, is we've got posts with pre-attached brackets.

[: 00:27:24

[00:27:40] Jeff Schulz: Mm-hmm. and we can help you with speed of installation. And so a pre-attached bra, a post with pre-attached brackets. Now it's not getting out there doing measurements to say where my brackets go. I set my post hang my panels and I save four to five hours on an install because my brackets are already

[: 00:27:53

[00:27:54] Eric Goranson: And then because this is metal, the worst part of it is that if you didn't have those, the contractor that goes, [00:28:00] man, I was just thinking about going to lunch and I I need two more posts cuz I drilled that one around. Right, exactly. Because they're like, oh, what was I. You know, was

[: 00:28:08

[00:28:12] Tim Sandlund: Yeah. Right. So high end everything, custom fabrication. The only railing they offer outside of that is Fortress. And the reason why is at the 26, cuz they'll go to their homeowners and if their price range is not up to a custom fabrication, sure. They go to Fortress and say, you're gonna get the same look, the same quality of a custom fabrication.

[: 00:28:30

[00:28:50] Eric Goranson: all day long.

[: 00:28:50

[00:29:07] Jeff Schulz: Well, and you know, so we, we, I think a lot of times we default to talking about railing, but the same thing applies in our, with our fence products. So we have Yes. You know, to. A completely assembled product versus a fabricator, which again, beautiful work and working with fabricators will often talk about, Hey, make that grand entryway.

[: 00:29:24

[00:29:39] Jeff Schulz: Yeah. Why does that matter? So it matters because we have an e eco in architectural grade. Code on our, on our steel product. Mm-hmm. . So if you look at that, that is, I talk, I talk about an automotive finish. That's where that come, comes from. Yeah. So the encoding systems really were developed, um, with the automotive industry back in the seventies.

[: 00:29:56

[00:30:15] Jeff Schulz: Fabricator, a fabricator made, do something beautiful and put it in a powder coat line. But that's a different process than adding e-coat in different layers. A seven, seven to 11 layer coating that we're putting on our products.

[: 00:30:26

[00:30:34] Eric Goranson: Right. You're putting on there period.

[: 00:30:36

[00:30:52] Jeff Schulz: It's gonna rust a hundred percent. When you've mass manufacturing in a controlled environment, a factory that has e eco architectural grade, all this, guess [00:31:00] what? It's not going. So,

[: 00:31:01

[00:31:10] Eric Goranson: They're welding in place. Yeah. It's all done. And the guy's in there going with an airbrushed. I'm like, . Well, there goes that finish, right. , I mean. Exactly. Yeah. And that's what the clients paid for, but, right. One thing I'd like to say, For that reason. Custom is not always better, right? Custom is a process of building and not a grade of material, right?

[: 00:31:36

[00:31:49] Jeff Schulz: talented. Yes. It means you've got skill, and I meant more power to you. I mean, I.

[: 00:31:54

[00:32:06] Eric Goranson: Right? Exactly. Exactly, exactly. We can't not talk about decking products.

[: 00:32:12

[00:32:30] Eric Goranson: You gotta put something quality down there. I mean, I remember funny story, my, my mom 15 years ago, my mom and dad's house in eastern Washington, they put one of the first, and I'll use. Let's say it was, starts with a tea, we'll just let that product go. And it was a fencing product. Like a, like a dinosaur.

[: 00:32:48

[00:33:12] Eric Goranson: Right? We tried to do something that was long term and it was like, ah, oh yeah, that's not working. Right. Not capped, not, you know, just all the, you know, it's, it's a particle

[: 00:33:23

[00:33:35] Jeff Schulz: And I, so I, we'll just say I know what you're talking about because it was, uh, identified and capitalized upon quite a bit. Yeah. But it is, uh, you know, technology and, and it's not taking away from them, right? No, not at all. Technology has evolved. I mean, you talk about Intel, I mean, look every four years where processor speed double or, or something, I don't know what the exact calculation is.

[: 00:33:53

[00:33:53] Eric Goranson: at this iPhone that Apple keeps giving me every

[: 00:33:56

[00:34:07] Jeff Schulz: Exactly. So every product, but yeah, we, uh, so it's interesting you start with fence because we also offer a full line of composite fence products. So we have, um, a product called Oasis, which is a, uh, stick-built product. So if you are used to building wood stick built fence, whether it be a side by side board on board, Use that same nail gun.

[: 00:34:25

[00:34:36] Eric Goranson: called me or the evolver. Well, , you got a good beard, man. You gotta say car and a beard, you gotta go. So,

[: 00:34:42

[00:34:44] Jeff Schulz: It's got an octagonal post little design aspect to it as well. Yeah. So it's real, been very good for us. But that oasis, not only does that Oasis work as a standalone stick, Ends. We have a product called estate, which is a hybrid of ornamental iron and privacy. Yeah, so it is an [00:35:00] ornamental product in which you can add wood or you can add our Oasis pickets.

[: 00:35:03

[00:35:24] Jeff Schulz: With the longevity of composite as well. And we do. One last thing just to throw in, is that a estate we've actually made, we talked about the pergola kits. Yeah. We now offer an estate enclosure kit for single and double dumpsters, one skew. Oh my gosh. Everything you need to put in a single double, single dumpster or double dumpster, including ballards, everything.

[: 00:35:41

[00:35:57] Eric Goranson: See that?

[: 00:35:57

[00:36:16] Eric Goranson: that's when the neighbors start to judge and go, are you just putting that, you were busy last week, one of those weeks.

[: 00:36:22

[00:36:24] Eric Goranson: absolutely. Yeah. But you know what I mean, it's, it's, it's nice to be able to hide that stuff and get it from the, the side of the garage, even from a homeowner perspective.

[: 00:36:34

[00:36:50] Eric Goranson: You're not out there making 'em look good. Exactly. They're

[: 00:36:52

[00:37:07] Jeff Schulz: I need to find a manufacturer for railing and a manufacturer. This a pergola. We come in and say, here we are. Single source everything you need. Here's your cladding, here's your decking, here's your skill frame. Here's, uh, a garbage dumpster enclosure. Here's pergolas. So we're working on multiple, uh, multi-family projects right now where it's, here's your garbage dumpsters.

[: 00:37:26

[00:37:35] Eric Goranson: Well, let's talk commercial for just a second. I mean, I can't tell you how many times, you know, I'm in the Portland, Oregon, Oregon area, so we get rain in that wintertime that just destroys stuff.

[: 00:37:44

[00:38:07] Eric Goranson: The best out there. It's not being maintained. A lot of times. Some people, they have that outdoor patio and that door gets open when they inspect it. Right. And it doesn't go back out until they're done. But again, that commercial stuff makes a lot of sense just on the durability standpoint. Yeah,

[: 00:38:21

[00:38:24] Jeff Schulz: Um, but even from a commercial perspective, to your point, we get that there's different types of builders, right? There's somebody who wants to build and turn that project, or a builder that wants to hold it. And if you're a builder that truly wants to hold properties, there is, you need to be thinking about the amortization, thinking about that law, that life, that longevity.

[: 00:38:42

[00:38:58] Jeff Schulz: You're gonna have back [00:39:00] repainting that versus let's put it up this. Them that's engineered and manufactured for, for, uh, for, um, long length of install. Yeah, exactly.

[: 00:39:08

[00:39:17] Eric Goranson: Maybe they're, they're buying, uh, as an income property, maybe a, you know, a duplex or a quadplex or something like that. Again, those are the things where you need to spend that money. It's not more, you're actually spending the right amount of money and long term it. It's a thoughtless math to figure that out.

[: 00:39:34

[00:39:35] Jeff Schulz: you. And even with, you know, single family builders, you look at a, uh, housing subdivision, right? So somebody drives up to the housing subdivision if they see a, and it takes you three or four years to build that sub subdivision. Yeah. Oh, I'm just gonna put wood fence around this subdivision.

[: 00:39:50

[00:40:11] Jeff Schulz: Imagine the touch, the field of longevity for commercial is now applying to your residential project.

[: 00:40:15

[00:40:27] Eric Goranson: Do help. Yes. Send the neighbor, send it over to the neighbors. Sorry, neighbors. But at least it's, yes. You know, you can actually bounce the sound a little bit with that stuff too. Right. It's not like it's concrete. Right. But there's enough mass to it. I've noticed that it can make a noticeable difference on noise.

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[00:40:49] Tim Sandlund: We offer two, two types a deck, right. Composite and a PVC decking. Yeah. Um, I, I'll talk specifically more about our pvc, which is our apex line of.

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[00:41:17] Tim Sandlund: The other one, they have that kind

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[00:41:23] Tim Sandlund: And you can feel it like, like you walk around on the deck and, and. I was talking to Bill, who's one of our, he's been in the decking industry for years, and you're saying yesterday that they've done testing in Europe on like slip resistance.

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[00:41:42] Eric Goranson: our location's all good.

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[00:41:57] Tim Sandlund: Yeah. Cladding applications

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[00:42:14] Eric Goranson: A lot of commercial stuff. Yeah. It's great. Well, one thing too, and I want to touch on this cuz it's something that we have out on the west coast, especially on the coastal areas that get a lot of rain, for instance, and I'm sure you see it in other parts of the country as well. But specifically for us, when we get through those winter months of rain, after rain, after rain, everything has this like slippery.

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[00:42:57] Eric Goranson: I'm gonna enjoy it. Right. That [00:43:00] texture could make a huge difference in that. Yeah. It.

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[00:43:11] Jeff Schulz: Yeah, that's key. So that is then R 13, which is the European floor, uh, slip resistance. Yeah. And so you think about not only that, but as we continue to see like aging and the certified aging in place, you know, all these different things.

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[00:43:44] Jeff Schulz: So having that R 13 slip rating is great for even that. Anyone but certified aging in place where you start paying. I'm not saying it's a certified, you know what I'm saying? It's No, it's, it's smart. Thinking about that as we're building homes now, from that perspective, thinking about using that as an aspect for [00:44:00] someone who might be aging.

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[00:44:01] Eric Goranson: right now, multi-generational housing is huge. Right. We all know that. We've been talking about it for a while, especially with everything from the, the younger people that can't find affordable housing to your grandparents. You're like, well, hey, they, they're gonna, They go into Retirement Village right now, , there's no way.

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[00:44:28] Jeff Schulz: right? Yeah. And so the green pattern too, so, and Tim touched on this a little bit, but I, you know, We're obviously gonna be a little biased, but having come from my background composites before coming to Fortress, I will tell you that grain pattern truly is the most realistic wood, wood look that I have seen on a non-wood board.

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[00:44:51] Eric Goranson: Yeah. The, the pictures, you can't, you can't capture it in the, in the graphics as with any kind of camera. But when you. You can definitely see this is a different [00:45:00] made product than everybody else is doing. So what have we not touched on today, guys?

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[00:45:09] Eric Goranson: We talked about use falling in the bathtub almost in the bathtub. Good personal. Yeah, exactly.

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[00:45:26] Jeff Schulz: Having that total. Of railing as well from residential, and I keep touching on that commercial, but you look at, um, our FE 26 plus for example, is rated to unlimited heights. So if you had a 200 story building, fine, I'm not seeing many, you know, but No, but you get 200 very. Yeah. It meets code to be on that 200 story and yeah.

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[00:46:02] Jeff Schulz: You can't use it because it doesn't meet code. So we spend a lot of time in focus on code for all of our products, um, including the rails.

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[00:46:22] Tim Sandlund: Um, someone put it on their home and a massive tree, I think actually happened in your region. It was up in Washington. Um, a massive tree fell on the deck and the aluminum railing saved the entire deck. The tree landed, get out, landed on the AL 13 plus or aluminum commercial. Yeah. And saved the entire deck.

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[00:46:56] Eric Goranson: wood railing on that.

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[00:47:01] Tim Sandlund: Right. And those are the things that I think you, you can't really plan for, right? Sure. But it, it's you, you choose between different products. You may find a product that's cheaper.

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[00:47:25] Tim Sandlund: Yeah. That's. Down in the steel framing. All our other products are built to last and, and steel framing is that piece that is 98% steel wood. Well now we're changing that, right? Yeah. And, and you're seeing it. You can walk around this show. You do see alternative framing solutions. Yeah. A lot more than you saw last year.

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[00:47:59] Jeff Schulz: [00:48:00] Yeah. No, we, we agree. I mean, we, uh, we truly do, I mean, we spent about seven years really doing research on the product, traveling.

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[00:48:34] Jeff Schulz: Absolutely.

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[00:48:54] Tim Sandlund: It's all fortress. And we have the complete system when it comes to the evolution [00:49:00] framing system. You don't have to get parts and pieces from other manufacturers to, to put it together and it's, we're gonna warrant you. We're gonna stand by our product. Yeah. Hey, you can we talk about ease of buying, right?

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[00:49:25] Eric Goranson: contract if they're building that deck right, is spending hours getting that plane for all those deck choice.

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[00:49:44] Tim Sandlund: are at Steel

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[00:49:58] Eric Goranson: Right. Just to get it there. And that's where that [00:50:00] makes the most sense guys. It just really does. Well man, thanks guys. Thanks for taking the time today. This has been great. And uh, I know our audience. There really appreciates learning more about steel stuff like this because that's really the wave of the future and uh, anything that lasts longer, saves the money in the long run.

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[00:50:18] Jeff Schulz: simple that way. A hundred percent. Yeah. And we, you know, so we appreciate you having us and for all the listeners out there reach us if. Fortress bp.com. Uh, we'll have local representatives. We can have our internal team, whether it be specifications, we can help you with that project. If you're thinking, how do I try steel framing, for example?

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[00:50:50] Jeff Schulz: You get to that third install, it's, I get it. It is faster than wood. My tools aren't really different. I mean, I might have one, I have a different saw, and that's it. Everything else is working the same, so.

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[00:51:04] Eric Goranson: All right. Have a great day. Thank you. Appreciate it. All right guys. Thanks. And I'm Eric G. And you've been listening to Around the House